RPGM Peasant's Quest [v3.71] [Tinkerer]

[FunFuntomes]

Human with antlers, no. Human with deer legs, yes.

arbitrary
adjective
ar·bi·trary ˈär-bə-ˌtrer-ē -ˌtre-rē
Synonyms of arbitrary
1
a
: existing or coming about seemingly at random or by chance or as a capricious and unreasonable act of will
an arbitrary choice
When a task is not seen in a meaningful context it is experienced as being arbitrary.
—Nehemiah Jordan
b
: based on or determined by individual preference or convenience rather than by necessity or the intrinsic nature of something
an arbitrary standard

 

[storm1051787]

arbitrary
adjective
ar·bi·trary ˈär-bə-ˌtrer-ē -ˌtre-rē
Synonyms of arbitrary
1
a
: existing or coming about seemingly at random or by chance or as a capricious and unreasonable act of will
an arbitrary choice
When a task is not seen in a meaningful context it is experienced as being arbitrary.
—Nehemiah Jordan
b
: based on or determined by individual preference or convenience rather than by necessity or the intrinsic nature of something
an arbitrary standard

I mean did I ever say what we are arguing about wasn't arbituary? Because it is, I'm pretty sure I aknodged that it was subjective where people draw the line. I'm just saying what's generally considered to be the standard on what is and what isn't a monster girl and it's always been about looks. Just like how people generally don't consider catgirls to be furries until you give them fur everywhere. Lamias are too drastic in apperance from a normal human to be considered anything, but a monster girl. Same with centaurs and Satyrs. But the traditional fantasy races? No not really, they look to much like regular people to be considered.


I was mostly opposed to bring Tolkienism and mythology as an argument for being a monster girl or not, and not just judging based on looks. If you want to consider orcs monster girls, then imo you need to consider all non humans to be monster girls..

 

[FunFuntomes]

I mean did I ever say what we are arguing about wasn't arbituary? Because it is, I'm pretty sure I aknodged that it was subjective where people draw the line. I'm just saying what's generally considered to be the standard on what is and what isn't a monster girl and it's always been about looks. Just like how people generally don't consider catgirls to be furries until you give them fur everywhere. Lamias are too drastic in apperance from a normal human to be considered anything, but a monster girl. Same with centaurs and Satyrs. But the traditional fantasy races? No not really, they look to much like regular people to be considered.


I was mostly opposed to bring Tolkienism and mythology as an argument for being a monster girl or not, and not just judging based on looks. If you want to consider orcs monster girls, then imo you need to consider all non humans to be monster girls..

fine... let's use the orc you posted as an example... do you see any inhuman characteristics?

 

[storm1051787]

fine... let's use the orc you posted as an example... do you see any inhuman characteristics?
View attachment 4566874

Aside from tusks no, that's my whole point. If you turn them gray they could pass for a dark elf. But this is very much just a muscular green human. They're not realy any different from elves so unless you also consider elves to be monster girls I don't get the pint in considering Orcs to be monster girls

 

[FunFuntomes]

tusks

and that's one trait, you missed the pointy ears

If you turn them gray they could pass for a dark elf.

if grandma could get a bonet she'd be grandpa

muscular green human.

unnaturally muscular

 

[storm1051787]

and that's one trait, you missed the pointy ears

if grandma could get a bonet she'd be grandpa

unnaturally muscular

I didn't miss the pointy ears. That's why I said if you turn them gray they pass for a dark elf. They're not drastically different in apperance from humans or other humanoid fantasy races like elves or dwarves.


And that's not unnaturally musclar at all. Most stock barbarian type characters have that same body type.


And it's not like you can't find thinner female orcs on the internet. It doesn't really make a ton of sense to consider orcs monster girls, but not elves

 

[FunFuntomes]

I didn't miss the pointy ears. That's why I said if you turn them gray they pass for a dark elf. They're not drastically different in apperance from humans or other humanoid fantasy races like elves or dwarves.


And that's not unnaturally musclar at all. Most stock barbarian type characters have that same body type.


And it's not like you can't find thinner female orcs on the internet. It doesn't really make a ton of sense to consider orcs monster girls, but not elves

that's because in tolkien's lore orcs were elves corrupted bymorgoth

 

[storm1051787]

that's because in tolkien's lore orcs were elves corrupted bymorgoth

Yeah except the Peter Jackson orcs do look drastically different from elves. Orc women like that I would consider monster girl. But 99% of the time when it comes to orcs in fantasy it's more like the picture I sent. She orcs especially, since people sexualizing them don't want them to look to drastically different and want them to look more like an Amazonian beauty

 

[FunFuntomes]

Yeah except the Peter Jackson orcs do look drastically different from orcs. Orc women like that I would consider monster girl. But 99% of the time when it comes to orcs in fantasy it's more like the picture I sent. She orcs especially, since people sexualizing them don't want them to look to drastically different and want them to look more like an amazon beauty

that is still your subjective opinion based on your atraction to she-orcs. we are talking abut orcs as a species and in most settings they are the result of unnatural interference that created monsters

 

[storm1051787]

that is still your subjective opinion based on your atraction to she-orcs. we are talking abut orcs as a species and in most settings they are the result of unnatural interference that created monsters

No it's really not. It's a pretty common complaint that female orcs tend to be fairly sexualized so they tend to look more like humans. And like I said earlier their origin is not relevant whether or not something is a monster girl. It's about how closely they resemble humans. Most female orcs are just like in this meme and are just green barbarian babes. And honestly it's just a thing with fantasy barbarians in general. Barbarian guys tend to be roided out and barbarian women are more like red Sonja

 

[DomWolf]

I'm not really sure why you got into the "natural order" thing. That doesn't have anything to do with what I said. I said it's about how closely they resemble humans and they need to be something more than star trek level aliens to be monster girls. It's not about what you define as being a "monster" just like it's not about what their origin is. Anything else is overcomplicating it. The giantesses aren't monster girls because they're just really big humans, the elves aren't monster girls because they're just humans with pointed ears, and most orcs are just stocky or muscles green humans with tusks. I guess it's subjective where people draw, but it's mostly a scale on how closely they resemble a normal human. Angels vs Harpies

At this point I feel we need Tinkerer to way in & tell us cos this argument is getting g boring. You're point is based on SOME depictions of a race of souped-up Goblins created by an author that never existed before then & have been changed, used & represented by almost every fantasy creator that has followed. If Orcs arnt monster girls the Goblins are not monster either. End of story.

 

[DomWolf]

I didn't say they are human just that they look like them, but yeah Erevi's daughter isn't a mnster girl and Namaah is. You pretty much described exactly what I was saying.


As for monster Musume it's actually a perfect example of what I'm talking about. Most of the girls don't have human legs and have scales of feathers or something. They're all way further away from looking like a human than an Orc

But they are BOTH Succubi, ED is literally a clone of Naamah... you're logic is failing now

 

[DomWolf]

She orcs especially, since people sexualizing them don't want them to look to drastically different and want them to look more like an Amazonian beauty

You can make that argument for ANY mythical or Sci-Fi race ever created by horny nerds. Which most of us are let's be honest.

 

[DomWolf]

No it's really not. It's a pretty common complaint that female orcs tend to be fairly sexualized so they tend to look more like humans. And like I said earlier their origin is not relevant whether or not something is a monster girl. It's about how closely they resemble humans. Most female orcs are just like in this meme and are just green barbarian babes. And honestly it's just a thing with fantasy barbarians in general. Barbarian guys tend to be roided out and barbarian women are more like red Sonja

Ok so would u say Orc males are monsters? But the sexy Orc females are not Monster Girls? You cant have both there the same species dude

 

[storm1051787]

At this point I feel we need Tinkerer to way in & tell us cos this argument is getting g boring. You're point is based on SOME depictions of a race of souped-up Goblins created by an author that never existed before then & have been changed, used & represented by almost every fantasy creator that has followed. If Orcs arnt monster girls the Goblins are not monster either. End of story.

Stop bring up tolkien. This has always been a debate about apperance and not their role in the story. I kept bringing up dnd earlier because fantasy orcs in modern fantasy tend to take their apperance from dnd. And yes I agree it's boring. Most people don't consider orc women too be monster girls. Your free to disagree, but that's not the general consensus

But they are BOTH Succubi, ED is literally a clone of Naamah... you're logic is failing now

I've explained my logic multiple time. It's you who doesn't really understand it. I've said over and over again that it's all about appearance not about what "race" they are. Most demons in fantasy can look however they want, but most people don't coni. You're the one who is hung up on author's intent and folklore when that's not how anyone defines monster girl.

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It's about visual characteristics. Not any sort of character traits or origins.

You can make that argument for ANY mythical or Sci-Fi race ever created by horny nerds. Which most of us are let's be honest.

I mean I kind of did earlier when I kept mentioning star trek

 

[storm1051787]

Ok so would u say Orc males are monsters? But the sexy Orc females are not Monster Girls? You cant have both there the same species dude

Yes. Like I said over and over again it's literal about appearance and you're over complicating it. Does this look close to a human? If yes it's not a monster girl, if no then it's a monster girl. It's not about whether or not they're an actual monster it's about whether or not they look like a monster.

 

[FunFuntomes]

It's not about whether or not they're an actual monster it's about whether or not they look like a monster.

so zombies aren't monsters 'mkay

 

[storm1051787]

so zombies aren't monsters 'mkay

Monsters aren't the same thing as monster girls. Monster girls is about female characters with a monster like appearance. Whether or not a zombie is monster girl depends on how deformed she is. If she's just a human with an odd complexation she's not.

 

[FunFuntomes]

Whether or not a zombie is monster girl depends on how deformed she is. If she's just a human with an odd complexation she's not.

so you admit that a female orc is a monster girl

 

[storm1051787]

so you admit that a female orc is a monster girl

I'm not at all sure how you took that from what I said. If anything I would think the fact I just said a different skin tone isn't enough would suggest the opposite. Especially since that was my main argument against them being monster girls. Even if you google monster girls you mostly just get results for hybrids. Stuff like elves, angels, demons, orcs generally arent included. It's mostly just stuff like Lamia and harpies.